Mr. Retrofire
Apr 6, 07:08 PM
The GPU performance decrease is much more severe that you let on...
...VDA (Video Decode Acceleration) framework support : Intel 3000HD isn't supported, forget hardware accelerated decoding of Flash content in H.264.
Apple does not install Flash Player on newer machines, so this is not a problem.
Try youtube.com/html5 (http://www.youtube.com/html5) or ClickToFlash (http://rentzsch.github.com/clicktoflash/) or other HTML5-Safari extensions (http://www.macupdate.com/find/mac/html5%20extension)!
OpenCL. Big selling point for Snow Leopard, absent from most of their hardware line-up now.
You obviously know nothing about OpenCL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenCL). OpenCL is not hardware dependent. OpenCL programs can run even on old 300 MHz PowerPC processors, if someone writes a OpenCL-compiler for this platform.
...VDA (Video Decode Acceleration) framework support : Intel 3000HD isn't supported, forget hardware accelerated decoding of Flash content in H.264.
Apple does not install Flash Player on newer machines, so this is not a problem.
Try youtube.com/html5 (http://www.youtube.com/html5) or ClickToFlash (http://rentzsch.github.com/clicktoflash/) or other HTML5-Safari extensions (http://www.macupdate.com/find/mac/html5%20extension)!
OpenCL. Big selling point for Snow Leopard, absent from most of their hardware line-up now.
You obviously know nothing about OpenCL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenCL). OpenCL is not hardware dependent. OpenCL programs can run even on old 300 MHz PowerPC processors, if someone writes a OpenCL-compiler for this platform.
EGT
Nov 29, 06:28 AM
I was waiting for this to happen. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out. (Go Steve!)
Bloody Universal. :rolleyes:
Bloody Universal. :rolleyes:
Multimedia
Aug 26, 08:28 PM
On the day that the MBP's with merom go on sale, I wonder WHAT TIME Apples website will change and display the new products? :confused:Updated Wesbite Is Usually by 9 Eastern. Occasionally later. But usually then. :)Probebly 10:00AM - 11:00AM Pacific time.No.Eastern? That's 6:00AM Pacific? You think? 9:00AM Pacific sounds good.No. its usually by 6AM Pacific 9AM Eastern. I KNOW - not guessing.
~Shard~
Jul 14, 04:55 PM
I wasn't being a smartass.
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shawnce
Aug 27, 07:27 PM
Now. But how much have iMac prices changed since release? I don't think they have. They released the iMac and MBP lines around the same time Yonah was intro'ed, and the iMacs did not see any speed bumps or price changes that I know of. Therefore they should be able to implement similar pricing with Conroe @ 2.4GHz, just with a profit margin closer to the iMac release amounts. Apple new future pricing plans looong before we did... they likely picked the price point with that in mind.
JackSYi
Aug 6, 03:09 AM
I really think Apple should buy out Quicksilver and implement it with Spotlight.
Astro7x
Apr 7, 02:54 PM
It's easy. The average person isn't watching blu-rays on a 27 inch or less screen. They get them for their big 50-60 inch TVs. And the sales of Macs are rising despite the lack. True professionals do what is needed to get the job done. Including buying a stand alone drive and 3rd party software if the simple menus in DVD Studio Pro are not enough
I disagree. I would argue that the reason people are not watching Blurays on their computers is because they CAN'T watch them on a computer. Blowing up a regular DVD to full screen on an Apple 27 inch cinema display looks horrible, and the alternative is a highly compressed H264 that looks amazing in comparison. I guarantee that if every Mac shipped with a Bluray drive, I'd have more clients requesting Bluray discs. Clients seem to love DVDs because they are dummy proof. Bluray? The smart ones will have to wait to watch it until they get home where they can put it on their PS3 or something. The others will stick it in their MacBook and then send me an E-mail saying that the DVD they received doesn't work.
Apple has to see financial benefits in not including Bluray in their computers. The professionals will add a drive to their MacPros so they can burn them. But consumers? Apple would no doubt take somewhat of a hit in profit for every Bluray drive that goes into a Mac. They'd also rather sell the HD media through the iTunes Store and make a profit there too. I'll admit it, one of the reasons I haven't switched completely over to buying Bluray Discs is because I can't watch them on my Laptop.
I disagree. I would argue that the reason people are not watching Blurays on their computers is because they CAN'T watch them on a computer. Blowing up a regular DVD to full screen on an Apple 27 inch cinema display looks horrible, and the alternative is a highly compressed H264 that looks amazing in comparison. I guarantee that if every Mac shipped with a Bluray drive, I'd have more clients requesting Bluray discs. Clients seem to love DVDs because they are dummy proof. Bluray? The smart ones will have to wait to watch it until they get home where they can put it on their PS3 or something. The others will stick it in their MacBook and then send me an E-mail saying that the DVD they received doesn't work.
Apple has to see financial benefits in not including Bluray in their computers. The professionals will add a drive to their MacPros so they can burn them. But consumers? Apple would no doubt take somewhat of a hit in profit for every Bluray drive that goes into a Mac. They'd also rather sell the HD media through the iTunes Store and make a profit there too. I'll admit it, one of the reasons I haven't switched completely over to buying Bluray Discs is because I can't watch them on my Laptop.
BRLawyer
Aug 26, 02:54 PM
Let's make it clear. The first revision of any highly integrated system is produced with an acceptable failure rate. With results coming in, failures recorded and internal testing continuous between the life of the first and second revision you will see a drop in failures in the next revision.
Every item that is in the next revision will have been tested, more flaws removed, etc. No piece of hardware is released with zero defects. [human interference aside such as dropping the product, overheating it, intentionally forcing failure]
If for every 1000 systems shipped approximately 20 fail, after a minimum predicted total hours, this 2% attrition rate is highly desirable. If you can't accept it you can stop using technology, now.
For every ten people bitching on this board about failures there is over 1,000 that don't.
That's exactly what I wanted to say...there are 10 whiners in this MR board that make a lot of noise, compared to 1,000,000 out there that don't...so we always have the impression that Apple is faltering, which is totally nonsense.
What matter are the independent reports and the statistical data that show, continuously, how Apple leads the pack in terms of support, reliability and MTBF; the rest is anecdotal evidence.
It's not only about industrial quality, which often depends on outsourced companies, overseas workers and contractual enforcement. It's also about giving the support a customer needs...and Apple is second to none in that.
Every item that is in the next revision will have been tested, more flaws removed, etc. No piece of hardware is released with zero defects. [human interference aside such as dropping the product, overheating it, intentionally forcing failure]
If for every 1000 systems shipped approximately 20 fail, after a minimum predicted total hours, this 2% attrition rate is highly desirable. If you can't accept it you can stop using technology, now.
For every ten people bitching on this board about failures there is over 1,000 that don't.
That's exactly what I wanted to say...there are 10 whiners in this MR board that make a lot of noise, compared to 1,000,000 out there that don't...so we always have the impression that Apple is faltering, which is totally nonsense.
What matter are the independent reports and the statistical data that show, continuously, how Apple leads the pack in terms of support, reliability and MTBF; the rest is anecdotal evidence.
It's not only about industrial quality, which often depends on outsourced companies, overseas workers and contractual enforcement. It's also about giving the support a customer needs...and Apple is second to none in that.
CrackedButter
Aug 26, 04:41 AM
If you haven't been reading the comments, it would appear MOST people are complaining about the more recent models. I would agree with most that the Powermac G5's have had serious issues and now recent macbook's... Apple needs to do one of the following ... Higher Quality Assurance testing OR better support cause right now they're missing both.
Maybe so about the recent models but...
G3 iBooks suffered greatly from logic board problems, I didn't have any, AluBooks when they came out had loads of troubles with their screens and the palm rests and eMac's had their fair share of issues as well. I didn't suffer either on either of those issues.
My point is: It doesn't matter if it is intel or PPC designs. Hardware is going to fail and its potluck on how when and why.
Maybe so about the recent models but...
G3 iBooks suffered greatly from logic board problems, I didn't have any, AluBooks when they came out had loads of troubles with their screens and the palm rests and eMac's had their fair share of issues as well. I didn't suffer either on either of those issues.
My point is: It doesn't matter if it is intel or PPC designs. Hardware is going to fail and its potluck on how when and why.
Foxglove9
Jul 14, 02:52 PM
If those specs are real then I'm glad I didn't hold out for the Mac Pro and bought a used G5 a few months ago. Dual optical drive slots are nice but for me not necessary.
hob
Apr 5, 07:21 PM
Really? And yet, it seems to be good enough for the top directors in the industry.... some of the recent Academy nominated films were all edited on Final Cut, including the Cohen Brothers' "True Grit", and "Winter's Bone". Also, David Fincher and Francis Ford Coppola used FCP on their last films... these are all people that have access and can afford cutting their films on AVID and yet, they recently choose Final Cut Pro... so why do people even question it? :rolleyes:
Because those big name directors can afford a whole team of assistants to manage their assets? ;)
Because those big name directors can afford a whole team of assistants to manage their assets? ;)
Laird Knox
Apr 25, 04:38 PM
it looks like a different world from today,
but really it's less than 70 years ago that we had the NAZI regime here in germany. it's less than 25 years ago that we had an repressive surveillance society in east germany. if there is no apparent good in tracking personal data, one should object to it.
Score one for Godwin! ;)
but really it's less than 70 years ago that we had the NAZI regime here in germany. it's less than 25 years ago that we had an repressive surveillance society in east germany. if there is no apparent good in tracking personal data, one should object to it.
Score one for Godwin! ;)
Bonfire
Apr 25, 03:04 PM
Such a waste of time. If they're really that bothered by the "tracking," someone needs to tell them to put their phones on eBay and they'll get their money back in about 3 days to put towards another phone.
leekohler
Apr 28, 04:43 PM
Obama's too smart. :)
Oh snap! :D
Oh snap! :D
jonnyb
Mar 22, 03:01 PM
Hopefully Apple will take a cue from that.
Playbook . . . as in what sport coaches use to hold their plays . . . e.g. their next moves, their plans on winning the game.
A term that's barely used outside of north America. I wonder if RIM even thought of that?
Playbook . . . as in what sport coaches use to hold their plays . . . e.g. their next moves, their plans on winning the game.
A term that's barely used outside of north America. I wonder if RIM even thought of that?
bagelche
Apr 5, 09:36 PM
Heh. looks like foidulus had a similar idea. I missed that post. And MattInOz comes in with a reasonable rebuttal and more technical knowledge than I have.
I don't think either foidulus or I were saying they were completely siloed--I'm sure they had some level of access to the A/V code. The question is is it in SL. Possibly.
I don't think either foidulus or I were saying they were completely siloed--I'm sure they had some level of access to the A/V code. The question is is it in SL. Possibly.
spazzcat
Mar 22, 01:44 PM
Lol. So many kid Apple fanboys.
iOS is clearly outdated if compared to Honeycomb and QNX.
The iPad 2 is nice, but it needs more RAM. Multitasking is just terrible with few RAM and bad OS processes handling.
Multitasking in iOS is sometimes a joke, specially if you're web browsing and using some chat app (like IM+, BeeJive etc.).
I'm glad that RIM and Samsung come with those prices.
Next months will be crucial for me to decide the successor of my iPad 1.
I played with Honeycomb over the weekend on tablet, it's toy....
iOS is clearly outdated if compared to Honeycomb and QNX.
The iPad 2 is nice, but it needs more RAM. Multitasking is just terrible with few RAM and bad OS processes handling.
Multitasking in iOS is sometimes a joke, specially if you're web browsing and using some chat app (like IM+, BeeJive etc.).
I'm glad that RIM and Samsung come with those prices.
Next months will be crucial for me to decide the successor of my iPad 1.
I played with Honeycomb over the weekend on tablet, it's toy....
Iconoclysm
Apr 19, 08:28 PM
Apple may have expanded upon existing GUI elements, but it didn't invent the GUI. Very big difference there.
Interesting that you now notice the difference between the two when you started the entire discussion with your complete misunderstanding of someone already differentiating between the two...
Interesting that you now notice the difference between the two when you started the entire discussion with your complete misunderstanding of someone already differentiating between the two...
rovex
Apr 12, 06:28 PM
Please explain this. You'd buy an iPhone 5 with HSPA+, but not one with LTE ? Why ? Makes no sense at all.
The coverage and cost obviously.
The coverage and cost obviously.
eb6
Sep 19, 10:10 AM
30 days on refurbs might mean something actually...
Any ideas?
Could be that they are expecting a flood of returns after they introduce the new MB and MBP. And they are waiting so they can send out fresh referbs. Just a though.
Any ideas?
Could be that they are expecting a flood of returns after they introduce the new MB and MBP. And they are waiting so they can send out fresh referbs. Just a though.
epitaphic
Aug 18, 11:46 PM
So you think they put an extra processor in across the line just to be able to say they had a quad? Even the AnandTech article you used as a source showed here (http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2816&p=18) that PS took advantage of quad cores in Rosetta
Yes under some specific results the quad was a bit faster than the dual. Though with the combo of Rosetta+Photoshop its unclear what is causing the difference. However, if you compare the vast majority of the benchmarks, there's negligible difference.
Concerning Photoshop specifically, as can be experienced on a quad G5, the performance increase is 15-20%. A future jump to 8-core would theoretically be in the 8% increase mark. Photoshop (CS2) simply cannot scale adequately beyond 2 cores, maybe that'll change in Spring 2007. Fingers crossed it does.
Your points about latency and FSB are not separate negatives as you have made them. They are redundant theoretical concerns with implications of unclear practical significance.
I beg to differ. If an app or game is memory intensive, faster memory access does matter. Barefeats (http://barefeats.com/quad09.html) has some benchmarks on dual channel vs quad channel on the Mac Pro. I'd personally like to see that benchmark with an added Conroe system. If dual to quad channel gave 16-25% improvement, imagine what 75% increase in actual bandwidth will do. Besides, I was merely addressing your statements that Woodcrest is faster because of its higher speed FSB and higher memory bus bandwidth.
I am not worried. Everything anyone has come up with on this issue are taken from that same AnandTech article. Until I see more real-world testing, I will not be convinced. Also, I expect that more pro apps such as PS will be able to utilize quad cores in the near future, if they aren't already doing so. Finally, even if Conroe is faster, Woodcrest is fast enough for me ;).
Anandtech, at the moment, is the only place with a quad xeon vs dual xeon benchmark. And yes, dual Woodcrest is fast enough, but is it cost effective compared to a single Woodcrest/Conroe? It seems that for the most part, Mac Pro users are paying for an extra chip but only really utilizing it when running several CPU intensive apps at the same time.
I think you misread that. They were comparing Core 2 Extreme (not Woodcrest) and Conroe to see whether the increased FSB of the former would make much difference.
You're absolutely right about that, its only measuring the improvement over increased FSB. If you take into account FB-DIMM's appalling efficiency, there should be no increase at all (if not decrease) for memory intensive apps.
One question I'd like to put out there, if Apple has had a quad core mac shipping for the past 8 months, why would it wait til intel quads to optimize the code for FCP? Surely they must have known for some time before that that they would release a quad core G5 so either optimizing FCP for quads is a real bastard or they've been sitting on it for no reason.
Yes under some specific results the quad was a bit faster than the dual. Though with the combo of Rosetta+Photoshop its unclear what is causing the difference. However, if you compare the vast majority of the benchmarks, there's negligible difference.
Concerning Photoshop specifically, as can be experienced on a quad G5, the performance increase is 15-20%. A future jump to 8-core would theoretically be in the 8% increase mark. Photoshop (CS2) simply cannot scale adequately beyond 2 cores, maybe that'll change in Spring 2007. Fingers crossed it does.
Your points about latency and FSB are not separate negatives as you have made them. They are redundant theoretical concerns with implications of unclear practical significance.
I beg to differ. If an app or game is memory intensive, faster memory access does matter. Barefeats (http://barefeats.com/quad09.html) has some benchmarks on dual channel vs quad channel on the Mac Pro. I'd personally like to see that benchmark with an added Conroe system. If dual to quad channel gave 16-25% improvement, imagine what 75% increase in actual bandwidth will do. Besides, I was merely addressing your statements that Woodcrest is faster because of its higher speed FSB and higher memory bus bandwidth.
I am not worried. Everything anyone has come up with on this issue are taken from that same AnandTech article. Until I see more real-world testing, I will not be convinced. Also, I expect that more pro apps such as PS will be able to utilize quad cores in the near future, if they aren't already doing so. Finally, even if Conroe is faster, Woodcrest is fast enough for me ;).
Anandtech, at the moment, is the only place with a quad xeon vs dual xeon benchmark. And yes, dual Woodcrest is fast enough, but is it cost effective compared to a single Woodcrest/Conroe? It seems that for the most part, Mac Pro users are paying for an extra chip but only really utilizing it when running several CPU intensive apps at the same time.
I think you misread that. They were comparing Core 2 Extreme (not Woodcrest) and Conroe to see whether the increased FSB of the former would make much difference.
You're absolutely right about that, its only measuring the improvement over increased FSB. If you take into account FB-DIMM's appalling efficiency, there should be no increase at all (if not decrease) for memory intensive apps.
One question I'd like to put out there, if Apple has had a quad core mac shipping for the past 8 months, why would it wait til intel quads to optimize the code for FCP? Surely they must have known for some time before that that they would release a quad core G5 so either optimizing FCP for quads is a real bastard or they've been sitting on it for no reason.
steve no jobs
Apr 8, 12:35 AM
I read over at TechCrunch that it was to meet daily sales quotas, which is to benefit the store manager, mostly. They look better for hitting/beating their quota everyday, regardless of whether or not it is actually at all helpful to Best Buy.
So it sounds like Best Buy has stolen a page from communist China's playbook. That seems like good business practice.
And why would it be an accomplishment for a manager to sell the quota of ipads for the day? You could set up a shop that exclusively sells ipads in the depths of a cave inhabited by a fire breathing dragon and you'd still have fanboys lining up at 6am to get one.
So it sounds like Best Buy has stolen a page from communist China's playbook. That seems like good business practice.
And why would it be an accomplishment for a manager to sell the quota of ipads for the day? You could set up a shop that exclusively sells ipads in the depths of a cave inhabited by a fire breathing dragon and you'd still have fanboys lining up at 6am to get one.
Tears Apart
Mar 25, 10:30 PM
*roar*
bring it on, i'm ready
bring it on, i'm ready
gekko513
Jul 15, 12:27 PM
Also, 1GB of RAM, who are they kidding? More like Mac Amateur
Many prefer to buy their own RAM because it's usually cheaper. There would be more people crying if Apple bundled 2GB of expensive RAM. They could offer a RAM downgrade of course, but then why not just give the price of the downgraded version, which leaves us at square one again.
Many prefer to buy their own RAM because it's usually cheaper. There would be more people crying if Apple bundled 2GB of expensive RAM. They could offer a RAM downgrade of course, but then why not just give the price of the downgraded version, which leaves us at square one again.
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